Traumatized By MS Windows 11 - I need a hug :)

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Dr Cheeto Cornchip
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Re: Traumatized By MS Windows 11 - I need a hug :)

#21 Post by Dr Cheeto Cornchip »

CwF wrote: 2023-09-22 17:41 People walk around with enough phone compute to manage a lunar mission...
A lot of people are walking around with more computing power than they need, no question about it. A lot of that, though, is just salesmanship. I know a fairly well to do guy who bought himself a Microsoft Surface Book. And, you know, he's not very tech saavy so he just went to the store, told the salesman for what he needs a computer and the salesman sold him a Surface Book.

Really, insofar as the Surface line is concerned, he'd have been better off with the cheaper Surface Laptop, or really an even cheaper Asus or Lenovo. He's a marriage therapist and really only uses his computer to take notes and probably order the occaisional pleasantry from Amazon or Walmart. He doesn't play games, he doesn't do any 3D visualization or arcitectural rendering. The NVidia dGPU in his Surface Book is just sitting there sucking down watt after watt at idle, I doubt it ever even kicks in over the iGPU. But, like so many people in his financial bracket, he trusted the salesman to lead him in the right direction.

That's why they have more informed people making decisions in places like NASA. NASA's Perseverance rover on Mars, for example, is powered by a 233Mhz PowerPC 750 CPU. The same single core chip that powered Apple's iMac G3 in 1998. Of course NASA's technicians weren't looking to run physics simulations on Mars, their highest priority was reliability. And, apparently, the PowerPC 750 has a proven track record.

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Re: Traumatized By MS Windows 11 - I need a hug :)

#22 Post by Northpoint »

That's why they have more informed people making decisions in places like NASA. NASA's Perseverance rover on Mars, for example, is powered by a 233Mhz PowerPC 750 CPU. The same single core chip that powered Apple's iMac G3 in 1998. Of course NASA's technicians weren't looking to run physics simulations on Mars, their highest priority was reliability. And, apparently, the PowerPC 750 has a proven track record.
I would argue that when a command is sent to the Rover it takes up to 20 minutes. So there is no need for speed.
Get your linux on.

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Re: Traumatized By MS Windows 11 - I need a hug :)

#23 Post by Dr Cheeto Cornchip »

I wasn't suggesting that people should use twenty five year old single core processors because NASA did. I was suggesting that it is in the best interests of the individual not to pick something because it is new and expensive, but because it is the right tool for the job.

When we look at the Surface Book example, well my acquaintance here didn't just spend more than he needed on the initial purchase, but he's spending more on electricity, he has significantly reduced remote working time and ultimately the lifespan of his computer is significantly degraded as a result of the increased number of charge cycles imposed on the irreplaceable battery.

But there's even more going on here. Things that are less directly connected. This is a rather sophisticated GPU that is completely wasted, you might as well have taken it off the assembly line and thrown it in the trash. The GPU would have been better utilized to all of our benefit had it gone to someone that would have used it.

On top of that, what of the wasted man hours? The people who ran the chip fabs and the people who mined the mineral ore? We're not just throwing away chips here, we're throwing away a chunk of their lives. And you might say yeah, but it's only one wasted chip, but is it though? How many people are out there in this very same situation I wonder.

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Re: Traumatized By MS Windows 11 - I need a hug :)

#24 Post by steve_v »

Dr Cheeto Cornchip wrote: 2023-09-22 18:57NASA's Perseverance rover on Mars, for example, is powered by a 233Mhz PowerPC 750 CPU. The same single core chip that powered Apple's iMac G3 in 1998. Of course NASA's technicians weren't looking to run physics simulations on Mars, their highest priority was reliability. And, apparently, the PowerPC 750 has a proven track record.
A very specific kind or reliability I might add... Radiation-resistant (and tested) CPUS don't grow on trees, and the smaller the lithography the more susceptible they are.
So what we get is old silicon, both because it's been extensively tested and because it's inherently easier to harden against the kind of environment one will find outside the magnetosphere.

FreewheelinFrank wrote: 2023-09-22 08:39obligatory 45 minute update just when you want to go home
Or better yet, obligatory 45 minute update on a field laptop, followed by obligatory restart, crash, and rollback... While customer waits with eye-wateringly expensive production line equipment not producing and boss asks "why aren't you on the road yet?".
And still people look at me like I've grown an extra head when I tell them that if I must use winblows for some fancy vendor software, I'll damn well run the whole lot in a VM. :roll:
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Re: Traumatized By MS Windows 11 - I need a hug :)

#25 Post by Uptorn »

010101 wrote: 2023-07-20 21:28 This OS had I don’t know how many software programs installed...dozens and dozens. Most of these programs I wouldn’t have used. Some of these used a massive amount of space too. You wouldn’t believe all of the process that auto started. There were dozens of processes.
It is an OS that includes Candy crush pre-installed... on corporate images. Always great to have a system that once it's fired up for the first time, it begins sucking down GB of data, x100 for each workstation over the corporate network... for a children's game. *slow clap

And it is things like this about Windows that make me realize when normies say "I just can't stand computers!", it is because their perception is forged by software that basically hates them. So I really can't blame joe sixpack.

So W11 came out, I haven't had the misfortune of touching or seeing it. But thanks for the report from the front lines. I'll stay back here on my comfy Debian.

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Re: Traumatized By MS Windows 11 - I need a hug :)

#26 Post by pawRoot »

010101 wrote: 2023-07-20 21:28 this OS was using about 48%
Some OS's are using RAM for other tasks when it's unused.
So I wouldn't look at the RAM used in task manager.
010101 wrote: 2023-07-20 21:28 Unannounced to me, my data was be uploaded to the cloud – to one drive. I didn’t understand what was happening...at first. Then latter I learned that MS’s Edge Browser was sending my browsing data to them… by default!
Well you did something wrong.
I did many installs of Windows and never had such problem, also you can uninstall their cloud drive.

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Re: Traumatized By MS Windows 11 - I need a hug :)

#27 Post by steve_v »

Current windows versions auto-installing onedrive is a known phenomenon, as is MS using deceptive design (aka "dark patterns") to get users to enable sync.
These days you can't just casually use windows... unless you spend the time to thouroughly disarm it, windows uses you.
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Re: Traumatized By MS Windows 11 - I need a hug :)

#28 Post by pawRoot »

steve_v wrote: 2024-01-02 12:52 Current windows versions auto-installing onedrive is a known phenomenon, as is MS using deceptive design (aka "dark patterns") to get users to enable sync.
These days you can't just casually use windows... unless you spend the time to thouroughly disarm it, windows uses you.
It does auto install it, but it doesn't auto move your files to it's folder, so the user did something wrong, that's it.

And yes you can casually use Windows, why not?
Unless you care about some of the bloatware, which you can easily remove with tools like this one:

https://github.com/ChrisTitusTech/winutil

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Re: Traumatized By MS Windows 11 - I need a hug :)

#29 Post by SAVVYSCLUTTER »

It also sends data to McAfee, Steam and ad companies on install.
This account is no longer active. Visit my website.

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Re: Traumatized By MS Windows 11 - I need a hug :)

#30 Post by Debmann »

WIndows 11 is the most advanced spyware in the Universe.

Check out Portmaster: Portmaster

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Re: Traumatized By MS Windows 11 - I need a hug :)

#31 Post by steve_v »

Debmann wrote: 2024-01-04 23:54Check out Portmaster
I see your cpu-hogging "freemium", with built-in upgrade-nags and exemplary packaging and support, and raise you one non-obnoxious FOSS application firewall. :P
Unless you're referring to running it on windows of course... In which case I question the sanity of using an OS that requires such measures in the first place.
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Re: Traumatized By MS Windows 11 - I need a hug :)

#32 Post by Uptorn »

Somehow I missed postmaster when surveying application-aware firewalls. To my shock, despite being commercially developed, they post their source under AGPL.

Their dismissiveness toward the Debian issue however speaks volumes. I will always prefer an application that is packaged properly within the repository over some vendor supplied installer.
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Re: Traumatized By MS Windows 11 - I need a hug :)

#33 Post by steve_v »

I find
Uptorn wrote: 2024-01-05 06:47dismissiveness
Is standard when dealing with commercial "open source", and
Uptorn wrote: 2024-01-05 06:47packaged properly
Is quite the opposite.

In this case note also the ultra-lazy "mystery-meat download in postinst" "only for initial install" stub "packages", vendor auto-updater, and conspicuous absence of any build/install from source instructions in the repo...
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Re: Traumatized By MS Windows 11 - I need a hug :)

#34 Post by oswaldkelso »

If it's not packaged by Debian why should you trust their .deb? This is like windows users that just install any .exe package from some website on the internet then wonder why their system is even more compromised than it is already by running "Windows" TM

Distrusted sources are just that. Distrusted.

The fact it's AGPL'd means you have access to the source code so can build your own .deb or fork it. Or if you can't get someone else you trust to do it for you.

Corporate open source has very little trust worthiness be it copyleft or not. The copyright holder can change and re-license or become propitiatory on a whim.

Pick who you jump into bed with carefully.
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Re: Traumatized By MS Windows 11 - I need a hug :)

#35 Post by Uptorn »

steve_v wrote: 2024-01-05 12:41 I find

Is standard when dealing with commercial "open source", and

Is quite the opposite.

In this case note also the ultra-lazy "mystery-meat download in postinst" "only for initial install" stub "packages", vendor auto-updater, and conspicuous absence of any build/install from source instructions in the repo...
It is also very presumptuous of companies and projects who only provide .deb installers, in that they assume everyone is going to be running x86.

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Re: Traumatized By MS Windows 11 - I need a hug :)

#36 Post by Trihexagonal »

For all you closet Windows users here is a block TCP/UDP to and from port 0 rule I made for Win98 ConSeal PC Firewall and carried over to pf firewall. When I purchased a Thinkpad W520 that came with Win10Pro and entered that rule into the default Windows firewall it blocked Windows Update.

This is how it looks in pf firewall but you can se what it does.

Code: Select all

block quick proto [ TCP, UDP ] from any port = 0 to any
block quick proto [ TCP, UDP ] from any to any port = 0
UFW doe not recognize port 0 as a valid port:

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